EggXpert

As some of you may already know, this highly anticipated sequel to Infinity Ward's popular shooter, COD4: Modern Warfare has become the latest casualty in the console vs PC gaming wars.  Infinity Ward has announced that the game will not have dedicated servers like all of the previous COD games and instead will have "listen servers" like console games.  (ie. anyone can host a game from their home PC)  This effectively eliminates clans and modders from enjoying the game.  An online petition has over 111,000 signatures (Infinity Ward forums) but the company has rebuffed the PC community and refused to allow modding and dedicated servers.  Many are cancelling their pre-orders and the move could cost IW millions of dollars in PC sales.

What is your take on this development?  If you were planning on getting MW2 does this change your mind?

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modern warfare 1 is good enough, I can live without #2 if this is how they want to play. I dont spend thousand on my pc to not have any benefit over my 360.

I will probably still get the game...... from torrents

Almost my same opinion. However, since this game will probably work over Hamachi, it may not be that bad overall. If and only if it works over Hamachi.

Respectfully,

PROACEX1

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By Anonymous, 1929: "See the happy Moron. He doesn't give a d***. I wish I were a Moron-My word! Perhaps I am..."
By Mazer Rackham: "Early to bed and early to rise," Mazer Intoned, "makes a man stupid and blind in the eyes."

fabulouscoops:

As some of you may already know, this highly anticipated sequel to Infinity Ward's popular shooter, COD4: Modern Warfare has become the latest casualty in the console vs PC gaming wars.  Infinity Ward has announced that the game will not have dedicated servers like all of the previous COD games and instead will have "listen servers" like console games.  (ie. anyone can host a game from their home PC)  This effectively eliminates clans and modders from enjoying the game.  An online petition has over 111,000 signatures (Infinity Ward forums) but the company has rebuffed the PC community and refused to allow modding and dedicated servers.  Many are cancelling their pre-orders and the move could cost IW millions of dollars in PC sales.

What is your take on this development?  If you were planning on getting MW2 does this change your mind?

 Fabulos, I recomend you look into a game called ArmA 2 and Operation Flashpoint Dragon Rising... those are gonna be better for PC players. ArmA 2 is a game based more on realism, OFP Dragon Rising is more CoD 4 base...

 On that note, I am getting Modernwarfare 2... for the 360.  Its a console game in my eyes, it was never properly optimizaed on the PC in the first place. Plus part of the reason they are doing no dedicated servers is because its one step to eliminating peoples abilities to do custom made maps, and so forth, so that way PC users have to be the sheep  like console gamers and pay for the maps..

Plus it was never graphically intensive enough for me to want to get it on PC, nor strategic enough. I love my PC for more strategic stuff.. RTS, FPS that requires strategy (again, ArmA 2). Plus with MW2 I plan to get it on console because the friends I have who will be playing it will be playing it on console. So I get it on what ever my friends get it on.

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Not sure what you mean not properly otpimized for pc. I've played both and far prefer the pc version. As far as performance I think it also scaled very well. Even my old 6800 ran it fine on my spare lan pc.

As far as I'm concerned CoD is a pc Series. If they wan't to abandon there original fan base then fine I will abandon them too. Like you said there are too many good games out that I was going to pass up for this game (like arma 2).

Kardon:

 

Not sure what you mean not properly otpimized for pc. I've played both and far prefer the pc version. As far as performance I think it also scaled very well. Even my old 6800 ran it fine on my spare lan pc.

As far as I'm concerned CoD is a pc Series. If they wan't to abandon there original fan base then fine I will abandon them too. Like you said there are too many good games out that I was going to pass up for this game (like arma 2).

When I played CoD 4 there were too many glitches... People glitching in buildings, glitching off the map. The hit boxes were a little far fetched too. Getting headshots when my sights were an inch away (scaled) from his head.

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Arma 2 is buggy as heck. It'll take a ton of patching. It's also far more unoptimized then any CoD game, even CoD:WaW.

Flashpoint 2 is kinda meh in my opinion, so far I haven't found it to be more then average.

I'll be waiting for something else to spend my money on probably then any of these three games. Maybe Left 4 Dead 2.

Respectfully,

PROACEX1

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By Anonymous, 1929: "See the happy Moron. He doesn't give a d***. I wish I were a Moron-My word! Perhaps I am..."
By Mazer Rackham: "Early to bed and early to rise," Mazer Intoned, "makes a man stupid and blind in the eyes."

PROACEX1:

Arma 2 is buggy as heck. It'll take a ton of patching. It's also far more unoptimized then any CoD game, even CoD:WaW.

Flashpoint 2 is kinda meh in my opinion, so far I haven't found it to be more then average.

I'll be waiting for something else to spend my money on probably then any of these three games. Maybe Left 4 Dead 2.

Respectfully,

PROACEX1

ArmA 2 has been patched a lot. The only bugs were the single player campaign.. but who really played that is the OFP/ArmA franchise. Its a game about custom mission making...

Flashpoint 2 I agree is meh... but CoD 4 is meh... its an arcadish shooter.

Of course I find it strange you find it bleh but then plan to get L4D2... to me L4D was bland, 4 campaign missions that last no more than an hour each? 

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Kocrachon:

single player campaign.. but who really played that  

 L4D was bland, 4 campaign missions that last no more than an hour each?

Same thing with l4d as arma. No one is playing for the campaign its all about the pvp IMOP.

I love and hate cod4. I can't stand normal mode but hardcore is where it's at. Any one playing on normal is just a big fat noob lol

Kardon:

Kocrachon:

single player campaign.. but who really played that  

 L4D was bland, 4 campaign missions that last no more than an hour each?

Same thing with l4d as arma. No one is playing for the campaign its all about the pvp IMOP.

I love and hate cod4. I can't stand normal mode but hardcore is where it's at. Any one playing on normal is just a big fat noob lol

 

What he said about Left 4 Dead 2. My two cents to add to that:

I have about 12 people from J-Isle (Another forum I frequent, probably more often the EggXpert even) who'll probably will be playing it along with me, so the game is worth it more so then CoD where I've been there done that for each new game they come out with.

I played the demo for L4D, didn't find it worth my money. Left 4 Dead 2 will be tho since I have enough friends playing it I won't mind coughing up the expect price I'm going to pay ($35) for it. $15 bucks off and guaranteed Skype L4D2 players who I know? And all of this over Hamachi? Count me in.

If the game was like L4D (Which it essentially is), then I can survive with it so I can play with my friends. And just my friends, instead of the typically immature user base I've been finding in the CoD series. Heck, even in TWL and CAL I've found the immature "12 year olds" crying "hacks" becoming more of an annoyance then it's worth. I played all the way to the end of CoD:WaW MP in the matter of a few weeks, 10th prestige level 65. Did it really mean anything? Nope, because most of the people who reached that rank used the n00bish super EXP. servers.

I actually do find the "console" experience to be quite nice if you have friends you know who aren't immature "12 year olds." The PC version of the experience is just far better because you don't have to be crowded into a stuffy room with a bunch of nerds or jocks or whatever. It's a combination of the LAN party experience with the console gaming one where you don't have to wake up with whip cream covering half of your face or some nerd sucking on his thumb; nor do you scream randomly at your friends because someone dropped out or is lagging and ruins the whole game.

Modern Warfare 2 ruins the ability to set up a dedicated (namely private) server. And it's quite doubtful it'll run correctly over Hamachi. Left 4 Dead 2 I won't mind cause first issue is solved thanks to friends (circumvent the stupid matchmaking) and the second is almost guaranteed.

Arma 2 I've played a bit. Crysis in my opinion has better graphics and animations for the performance (Crysis Warhead has better performance but the gameplay is messed up now with the last patch). That's a scary thing to say seeing as how Crysis is a DX10 title; known to be pretty unoptimized itself; and used to make graphics cards grovel on their knee's back in the day. These days it's Arma 2, but not in a good way. Arma 2 has good gameplay, and it's very realistic. But it's honestly just not as fun as shooting zombies with friends without the trouble of the random moron literally getting in the way of the fun (AKA stop blocking the doorway! or Don't you know how to fly a helicopter?!). Playing with a friend you can just laugh when a boomer gets a hold of him and you just stand there laughing. Or when a tank slaps you into another friend and you both die laughing as you fall to the ground, dying in-game.

Find some friends. Play L4D2. Wait until someone comes out with a hack or mod or (not going to happen probably) a patch fixing the MD2 issue.

In the meantime enjoy killing zombies. And get the teletubbies mod so you can have super duper fun killing the worst thing ever invented on earth. Or heck, even the Ewok zombies mod (hopefully these will come out for L4D2, I'm not saying they will but we can hope, right?).

Respectfully,

PROACEX1

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By Anonymous, 1929: "See the happy Moron. He doesn't give a d***. I wish I were a Moron-My word! Perhaps I am..."
By Mazer Rackham: "Early to bed and early to rise," Mazer Intoned, "makes a man stupid and blind in the eyes."

Hey Eggheads,

 Ive been out of the loop for a while.

 I was going to order this game but now am not.  Im not one for signing petitions but I did on this one.  

If I wanted a console game I would buy a console, I agree with Kardon about the amount of money I spend on my PC I should have an edge over the console.  I also heard they have taken away the ability to lean on the game around corners and such, whats next....no jumping?  I think they will lose out on this one and blame bad PC sales to pirating,  they for sure lost my money.  

Why fix something if its not broke, if they release like this they will for sure ruin a title for the PC.  Another thing I picked up on today was they are only 18 person servers or 9vs9.

Ouch!!!  

Right on those points.

IW admitted that the PC game was essentially a console port and said (get this) that the PC game had special features that the console did not such as mouse support.  When mouse support becomes a "special feature" you know the PC was never considered as a platform for more than an afterthought.

 No lean

No modding

No dedicated servers

• 9v9 servers max
• Listen servers means

• Zero ping host, high ping clients
• if the host leaves the game pauses for 5 sec and a new host is found
• People who pay for downloads will be using up their bandwidth

MW2 effectively kills gaming clan communities on the PC who can no longer admin their servers to keep out disruptive players and monitor tatics that are not technically cheating like profanity, racist remarks, nade spamming and spawn killing which mature gaming clans frown upon.

This is a total FAIL for the PC.  Hopefully, if Treyarch or some other developer is thinking about COD7 they will keep this little PC teaparty in mind.

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fabulouscoops:

Right on those points.

IW admitted that the PC game was essentially a console port and said (get this) that the PC game had special features that the console did not such as mouse support.  When mouse support becomes a "special feature" you know the PC was never considered as a platform for more than an afterthought.

 No lean

No modding

No dedicated servers

• 9v9 servers max
• Listen servers means

• Zero ping host, high ping clients
• if the host leaves the game pauses for 5 sec and a new host is found
• People who pay for downloads will be using up their bandwidth

MW2 effectively kills gaming clan communities on the PC who can no longer admin their servers to keep out disruptive players and monitor tatics that are not technically cheating like profanity, racist remarks, nade spamming and spawn killing which mature gaming clans frown upon.

This is a total FAIL for the PC.  Hopefully, if Treyarch or some other developer is thinking about COD7 they will keep this little PC teaparty in mind.

Its not IW doing this... its Activision. Activision is trying to do this so that way they can push all gamers to the 360 and have one dominant console and not have to make cross platform games. Activision wants there to be one console so that it can save programing cost.

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I guess leaning around a corner is not a military tactic anymore.

I'm getting sick thinking about this.  I don't care who it was Activision or IW they sure did mess this "most anticipated FPS" up.

We PC folks just got nerfed.   Nice graph Kocrachon, p2p on my provider will be moot, piss off a host and he will kill his server, alot of ISPs do not allow servers to host services on residentual contracts.  Too many problems, maybe Ill just stick with 4 and World at War.  

The way I see it is that console gamers have been getting the shaft so long having to pay for extra content (map packs ect...) thats what I see next for PC.  They suckered the console players into this and "why not PC players sure they want to pay for stuff they have been getting at no extra cost for years" and I think most console gamers are kiddies, who dont know anybetter because mommies Emachine wont hang.  Nothing wrong with that I own consoles too and still play certain games on them.  Im just not a sucker for pay to play models.

 Now if they allowed us to cross platform and pwn the console players, that would be sweet but that wont happen either. 

Kocrachon:

fabulouscoops:

Right on those points.

IW admitted that the PC game was essentially a console port and said (get this) that the PC game had special features that the console did not such as mouse support.  When mouse support becomes a "special feature" you know the PC was never considered as a platform for more than an afterthought.

 No lean

No modding

No dedicated servers

• 9v9 servers max
• Listen servers means

• Zero ping host, high ping clients
• if the host leaves the game pauses for 5 sec and a new host is found
• People who pay for downloads will be using up their bandwidth

MW2 effectively kills gaming clan communities on the PC who can no longer admin their servers to keep out disruptive players and monitor tatics that are not technically cheating like profanity, racist remarks, nade spamming and spawn killing which mature gaming clans frown upon.

This is a total FAIL for the PC.  Hopefully, if Treyarch or some other developer is thinking about COD7 they will keep this little PC teaparty in mind.

 

Its not IW doing this... its Activision. Activision is trying to do this so that way they can push all gamers to the 360 and have one dominant console and not have to make cross platform games. Activision wants there to be one console so that it can save programing cost.

IW is also doing this, many of these choices being made are not something Activision directly has choices in doing, such as the 9v9 instead of 16v16.

Both of them are at fault, both of them are failing.

I wouldn't be surprised if the SP is screwed up on purpose for PC folks too. *facepalm*

Respectfully,

PROACEX1

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By Anonymous, 1929: "See the happy Moron. He doesn't give a d***. I wish I were a Moron-My word! Perhaps I am..."
By Mazer Rackham: "Early to bed and early to rise," Mazer Intoned, "makes a man stupid and blind in the eyes."

I read the chat session they had the other day and they are an arrogant bunch (IW)

I wonder if they will be impacted at all by sales.  Seems like they have made alot of people angry on thier own forums and deleting by "accident" the pettition thread several times.

Seals the deal.

What pisses me off the most is that they act liek they don't understand why we are upset. They act liek they are not doing anything wrong and we are just being whiney.

Just come out and say. "hey we are a business and we are here to make money. This is how we feel we will make the most." It will still suck but atleast it will be the truth. Don't drug and rape our game up the butt and then act like you don't know what we are talking about.

IW and Activision are the first entry on my new Registered Video Game Sex Offenders list.

Kardon:

 Don't drug and rape our game up the butt and then act like you don't know what we are talking about.

IW and Activision are the first entry on my new Registered Video Game Sex Offenders list.

Let it all out buddy, let it all out.

 Im tired of them insulting our intelligence.

This is the exact same thing that happened with Halo/Bungie/Microsoft. Maybe some would disagree, but I feel the same way about that franchise as you guys do with this one. I was intending on getting Modern Warfare 2 because most of my friends are moving to CoD, and we all used to play Halo but Microsoft/Bungie ruined it, and are milking the name for all its worth. I'm becoming really hesitant to buy MW2 now, because I've learned butting heads with these big companies/idiotic publishers gets you almost nowhere because they think they can keep all the naysayers at bay.

I'm also aware most of you are referring to PC based issues, and I am referring to console, but screwups are screwups regardless of what platform they exist on.

defiledfrog:

I guess leaning around a corner is not a military tactic anymore.

It's my favorite move in World At War zombies.. You sneak up on your teammate while he's shooting zombies through the window and then stand right behind him with your head tilted to the side like that one Owl "retards, everybody knows one" image..

Then he turns around and gets a good laugh.. Most awesome thing ever.

 It's almost as fun as "accidentally" throwing monkeys at people..

If you ever play paintball, it's not realistic without leaning / snapshooting..  So no leaning kills the realism of a game as well..

I like UT 3 bought it really cheap, it also has that sweet new PC feature of mouse and keyboard support that they thought was a good Idea at IW and decided to add it to MW2.

Game hits tomorrow I want to see a PC sales fail.  If its a console game they should just release a console version.  They are a business and can do whatever they like but they p****d off a bunch of people and hopefully numbers will show them this.  Doubt they will do anything but drop the PC alltogether but thats OK as long as they don't lead people on anymore.  

I think what happened with HALO 2 is that they released a really crappy console port to the PC with dated graphics.  Halo was fun so was Halo 2 but for PC it lacked in shine.   You cannot release a console port for PC 2-3 years later with the same dated graphics. Compared to games out at that time some made Halo look like someones poor attempt at polishing a turd, Halo 2 didnt look much better either.

The 9v9 limit is especially ridiculous.. Not only does moving away from dedicated server architecture require that more users send / receive more data to play the game (higher bandwidth requirements), but also now you've got limits on how many people can play the game smoothly.. It just doesn't make any sense..  Especially when you've got people who might be quite a distance away from each other trying to play together..

 In Peer 2 peer networking, your ping isn't a simple function between client and server, it becomes very dependent upon not only your Internet connection, but other people's as well..  Bad idea for a first person shooter.. Even if you have heartbeats that keep people in sync and let people who can't keep up, lag out, you're still going to feel the latency of other people's connections..

. On paper, P2P gaming is better because people with lower pings will not have any advantage over people with higher pings, but in reality that basically means that people with high pings can walk around a corner and snipe you before you even seen it happen. ie: All the laggy players will be all jittery-like and nearly impossible to get a clean shot off at, unlike a client-server architecture where laggy players are like shooting fish in a barrel.

 If you're a laggy player, or play internationally, the new networking setup in Modern Warfare 2 is a godsend... If not, then it really sucks to be you.. Way to punish people with expensive internet connections..

I'm sure this is NOT what Microsoft had in mine when unifying the architecture between the PC and consoles through DirectX.. 

Sidicas:

I'm sure this is NOT what Microsoft had in mine when unifying the architecture between the PC and consoles through DirectX.. 

I really doubt this is what they had in mind.  

On another note I got a coupon in my mailbox from Newegg for 5 dollars off PS3 or Xb360 version of MW2........I kind of chuckled this morning.

Now the egg is stiffing us...............just kidding.